Die Humanity Die's avatar

[DiM]

hmm i know what you mean DiM.. but i have just checked and DHD has never actually posted in the Flame Forum. (only once in any other Forum)

I honestly don't think that most of the blatant nonsense in Flame Wars is anywhere near as offensive as using an image of someones brain hanging out. (half a head blown off or whatever the harrowing image depicts).. this uses someones genuine death or serious maiming for some sort of entertainment. It is a different level altogether to the inane verbal jousting which most members do accept on face value.

yep i know he never posted in flames. it has nothing to do with the matter at hand.

flame forum has a bad influence on young kids by giving them the opportunity to act like dick-heads with no repercussions. as long as it stands there flame is a statement that CC tolerates this sort o stuff.

[jiminski]

hmm i know what you mean DiM.. but i have just checked and DHD has never actually posted in the Flame Forum. (only once in any other Forum)

I honestly don't think that most of the blatant nonsense in Flame Wars is anywhere near as offensive as using an image of someones brain hanging out. (half a head blown off or whatever the harrowing image depicts).. this uses someones genuine death or serious maiming for some sort of entertainment. It is a different level altogether to the inane verbal jousting which most members do accept on face value.

yep i know he never posted in flames. it has nothing to do with the matter at hand.

flame forum has a bad influence on young kids by giving them the opportunity to act like dick-heads with no repercussions. as long as it stands there flame is a statement that CC tolerates this sort o stuff.

hmm i think you are using an unrelated issue to highlight another which you have an axe to grind on.

We are talking about an image which will likely be blocked and you blame a Forum for influencing the user of the Avatar, when he may never even have visited the Forum. ..
it's a little like blaming tom and jerry for US gun-crime.

[kwanton]

hmm i know what you mean DiM.. but i have just checked and DHD has never actually posted in the Flame Forum. (only once in any other Forum)

I honestly don't think that most of the blatant nonsense in Flame Wars is anywhere near as offensive as using an image of someones brain hanging out. (half a head blown off or whatever the harrowing image depicts).. this uses someones genuine death or serious maiming for some sort of entertainment. It is a different level altogether to the inane verbal jousting which most members do accept on face value.

yep i know he never posted in flames. it has nothing to do with the matter at hand.

flame forum has a bad influence on young kids by giving them the opportunity to act like dick-heads with no repercussions. as long as it stands there flame is a statement that CC tolerates this sort o stuff.

hmm i think you are using an unrelated issue to highlight another which you have an axe to grind on.

We are talking about an image which will likely be blocked and you blame a Forum for influencing the user of the Avatar when he may never even have visited the Forum. .. it's a little like blaming tom and jerry for US gun-crime.

He's not blaming the forum for influencing the guy to choose that particular avatar.

He's saying that it is unfair to reprimand him for using that avatar while something like flame forum exists because, in his mind, flame forum is much worse.

DiM, the only flaw I see in your logic is that flame forum is confined to one forum but die's avatar can be in all forums. People can choose not to visit the flame forum but if die posts somewhere, then people will be forced to look at it. The fact that flame forums is so easily accesible is not an issue either. The issue is whether or not people look at something like that through their own decision or are forced to. That's why pornography and the like is against the rules.

Personally I have no problem with it. It's nothing that hasn't been in movies and whatnot. Others may have a different view however.

[jiminski]

He's not blaming the forum for influencing the guy to choose that particular avatar.

He's saying that it is unfair to reprimand him for using that avatar while something like flame forum exists because, in his mind, flame forum is much worse.

nah.. that's not what he's saying Kwanton, you need to read between the lines but i am sure he does not need me to explain his inference from the situation.

[firth4eva]

seriously coleman pm him
i did it and it got sorted

[DiM]

He's not blaming the forum for influencing the guy to choose that particular avatar.

He's saying that it is unfair to reprimand him for using that avatar while something like flame forum exists because, in his mind, flame forum is much worse.

nah.. that's not what he's saying Kwanton, you need to read between the lines but i am sure he does not need me to explain his inference from the situation.

actually kwanton is right. that's exactly what i mean. perhaps i haven't made myself clear enough. after all english isn't my first language. or even second. it's third

[DiM]

He's not blaming the forum for influencing the guy to choose that particular avatar.

He's saying that it is unfair to reprimand him for using that avatar while something like flame forum exists because, in his mind, flame forum is much worse.

exactly. except for the fact i don't think it's much worse. i put it on the same level.

DiM, the only flaw I see in your logic is that flame forum is confined to one forum but die's avatar can be in all forums. People can choose not to visit the flame forum but if die posts somewhere, then people will be forced to look at it. The fact that flame forums is so easily accesible is not an issue either. The issue is whether or not people look at something like that through their own decision or are forced to. That's why pornography and the like is against the rules.

actually my logic isn't faulty. let's use your cable tv for example. you have several porn channels among lots of normal ones. do you password protect those channels from your kid or do you let them stay as they are?

after all the kid can choose if he looks at them or not especially since they aren't right in his eye. he has to click a few buttons to get to them.

i'd password protect them or delete them. same goes for flame forum.

if a 12 year old comes to this forum and sees flames he's gonna enter it especially once he reads the description.

flame forum is like the cookie jar. the forbidden place that attracts you so much. any kid wants to get his hands into the cookies.



PS: also DHD's avatar can simply be adblocked if you find it offensive. so it's not in your eyes.

[RiskTycoon]

not to split hairs here but...... it may not be pornography, but it is pornographic......

[jiminski]

He's not blaming the forum for influencing the guy to choose that particular avatar.

He's saying that it is unfair to reprimand him for using that avatar while something like flame forum exists because, in his mind, flame forum is much worse.

exactly. except for the fact i don't think it's much worse. i put it on the same level.

You're a good guy DiM and i realise that this is not your first language, this in mind you are doing an extraordinary job at expressing yourself.
However this is an issue which gets me primed for debate.

I think that in fact i do need to express what you have inferred. Your implication, although you have hidden behind a literary tool or two in order to remain illusive. Is that the existence of Flame wars creates an atmosphere in which a disregard for authority and a disrespect of decency, allows such avatars and crudity in general to be used as a badge of honour.

Your assertion that you are defending the right to use such images, under the premise that it is no worse than the use of language in Flame Wars is the trick! You have pooled all questionable behaviour to fall under one church. As you would obviously like Flame wars to be removed and no unpleasant avatars used either.

If as you say you are not making a direct link, which you can of course not, then the whole line of your argument is irrelevant.

In my opinion, the use of a picture as sport which depicts a real person who died in horrific circumstance, is not even in the same bracket as some kids calling each other names.

A picture is worth a thousand words?.. Well i certainly don't close my eyes to be met by the searing vision of ronaldhinio with a shovel in his japs-eye! but i do have difficulty shaking away the image of a real person who died in immense sufferrring.

honestly it's not even a contest. Flame wars is, in general, a quasi-literate arena which may in fact act as vent, not an incitement to genuine violence or disruptive behaviour. (as you already loosely pointed out.)
The expletive and abusive tone is used in a largely metaphorical sense and derives more from sound and resonant combination than real intent and sincerity.

[kwanton]

actually my logic isn't faulty. let's use your cable tv for example. you have several porn channels among lots of normal ones. do you password protect those channels from your kid or do you let them stay as they are?

after all the kid can choose if he looks at them or not especially since they aren't right in his eye. he has to click a few buttons to get to them.


if a 12 year old comes to this forum and sees flames he's gonna enter it especially once he reads the description.

Exactly. That was my point. It is the children's choice whether or not to enter flame wars or look at pornographic channels. If they want to look at that stuff then they will. With so many venues there is no stopping it. To me, the whole problem with this issue is choice. If DHD posts in, let's say, callouts for instance, anyone looking for a game might see his avatar without knowing they will see it or choosing to see it. In that way, a person is forced to see an image they don't want to.

Bottom line: if someone finds flame wars offensive then they can just decide not to click on that forum. If someone finds DHD's (or whatever pornographic/offensive avatar/pic/whatnot) offensive and DHD posts in some random forum then SURPRISE! it's in your face.

[Nc_Hunt3r]

He goes on my ignore..


nuff said!

If I see to many avatars like that.. I'll quit playing all together.. And thats a fact!


The policies of this site are set up to the individual personal wants/beliefs etc.... In this case its most likely the owner. Thats the only way to explain why you can post a picture of someones head blown off but not a picture of breasts.

And DIM is right the comparison although different is in essence the same.. If this site is adult site it needs to be labeled as so if its kid friendly then it needs to be labeled so and treated so.. Thats why the movie people put ratings on movies.. If theres intense mutilation, cursing and nudity it gets a R if its a little bit of violence it gets a pg 13..

[DiM]

He's not blaming the forum for influencing the guy to choose that particular avatar.

He's saying that it is unfair to reprimand him for using that avatar while something like flame forum exists because, in his mind, flame forum is much worse.

exactly. except for the fact i don't think it's much worse. i put it on the same level.

You're a good guy DiM and i realise that this is not your first language, this in mind you are doing an extraordinary job at expressing yourself.
However this is an issue which gets me primed for debate.

I think that in fact i do need to express what you have inferred. Your implication, although you have hidden behind a literary tool or two in order to remain illusive. Is that the existence of Flame wars creates an atmosphere in which a disregard for authority and a disrespect of decency, allows such avatars and crudity in general to be used as a badge of honour.

Your assertion that you are defending the right to use such images, under the premise that it is no worse than the use of language in Flame Wars is the trick! You have pooled all questionable behaviour to fall under one church. As you would obviously like Flame wars to be removed and no unpleasant avatars used either.

If as you say you are not making a direct link, which you can of course not, then the whole line of your argument is irrelevant.

In my opinion, the use of a picture as sport which depicts a real person who died in horrific circumstance, is not even in the same bracket as some kids calling each other names.

A picture is worth a thousand words?.. Well i certainly don't close my eyes to be met by the searing vision of ronaldhinio with a shovel in his japs-eye! but i do have difficulty shaking away the image of a real person who died in immense sufferrring.

honestly it's not even a contest. Flame wars is, in general, a quasi-literate arena which may in fact act as vent, not an incitement to genuine violence or disruptive behaviour. (as you already loosely pointed out.)
The expletive and abusive tone is used in a largely metaphorical sense and derives more from sound and resonant combination than real intent and sincerity.

i have underlined the part where your judgment is biased.

i could rephrase it like this:

flame forum is a place where 12 year olds are taught that fowl language is the key to success, where all their moral values are shattered by the divinisation (not sure if this is a real word. it means when something is rendered divine) of stupidity meanness hypocrisy and utter disrespect whilst DMD's avatar is merely a photo taken from the brain surgery of a child that was born with a congenital malformation and was saved by great doctors.

the truth is probably somewhere between those two points of view. that's a nasty image regardless if it is from an operation or from an accident and the "calling of names" is actually far more than that.

i'm not saying flame wars caused that kid to put that image as his avatar all i'm saying is that if certain people are tolerated than that image should also be.

to be honest i don't really care if they both stay or go since i believe people find all kinds of nasty stuff all over the internet so CC with or without them won't make a difference in the big picture.

[Nc_Hunt3r]

whoa some post's were deleted

[jiminski]

you researched the image far better than I DiM, I saw the picture, was repulsed and formed a gestalt interpretation. The context changes the issue but only very slightly.

The meanness in Flame-wars is there for all to see but i think it is reflective more than formative.
I think it's cathartic and not corruptive.

Is that my bias? yes.. opinion is based upon view, which by definition is formed by certain bias. in the same way, you feel that nonsensical streams of words can be as formative as a gruesome image.

More than this, Flame Forum is just not meant to be serious.... seeing the open scull of someone in a life or death struggle is. it creates an acute empathy with the subject which, for me, is far more influential.

[Rocketry]

Am i the only one that dosent really mind about humanities avatar? Seems like none of my bussinus.

Must admit it made me look twice, but then i thought. erg...strange... and forgot about it. Not a nice picture, but you it wont bother me. I guess i will ignore it, except saying that suggests i care enough to bother ignoring it. Its more a case that i might see it and think nothing of it.

Rocketry

[jiminski]

Am i the only one that dosent really mind about humanities avatar? Seems like none of my bussinus.

Rocketry

shhhhh... we're just warming up.

[kwanton]

Am i the only one that dosent really mind about humanities avatar? Seems like none of my bussinus.

Must admit it made me look twice, but then i thought. erg...strange... and forgot about it. Not a nice picture, but you it wont bother me. I guess i will ignore it, except saying that suggests i care enough to bother ignoring it. Its more a case that i might see it and think nothing of it.

Rocketry

I said before that I don't mind it personally. I think most of us have seen worse things in movies and on TV. What I am trying to argue is that people should have the choice of viewing something like that or not.

[RiskTycoon]

what if i click his profile to view it? do I have a choice then?

[kwanton]

what if i click his profile to view it? do I have a choice then?

Not if you don't know what his avatar is but that is not the point. If he happens to post in a thread you're reading it pops up there too. Some people don't want to see that and they shouldn't have to.

Everyone has the right to look at whatever pictures they want to. But the converse is also true. Everyone has the right to not see whatever pictures they don't want to.

[RiskTycoon]

so you just brush it away ...because it isn't the point you are trying to make...nice argument

[RiskTycoon]

and you also use TV as an example....TV has ratings that are meant for certain age groups.....CC has no rating......

[Twill]

This thread got a bit off topic didn't it

Has anyone actually PM'd DHD and asked him to change it? usually just asking will solve a lot of problems especially if it comes from a mod (consider asking a mod to PM if you dont feel comfortable)

As to the Flame Forum topic, love the debate, consider starting a thread on it so you get more comments on it. I wont bother adding my thoughts because to be honest, DiM has already elaborated them much better than I probably could.

[firth4eva]

and you also use TV as an example....TV has ratings that are meant for certain age groups.....CC has no rating......

none of the internet has though
i could go watch some porn right now. no age limit is stopping me and how will people know whether i am 18 or not

[RiskTycoon]

so you just made my point for me ....not to mention i did say TV not the internet was his example not mine.....the point is...exactly what you said...there is no age limit here...why did you say it twice? it make no sense....what i am saying is there is no reason for it......i've said before, I feel the same way about flame wars...It should be gone...this is a family site and many age groups play here.....it's just a plain silly stupid thing and there is no need for it.....

[firth4eva]

Has anyone actually PM'd DHD and asked him to change it? usually just asking will solve a lot of problems especially if it comes from a mod (consider asking a mod to PM if you dont feel comfortable)

so basically we should all message him. ill get right on it