Jesus Freaks...why do you believe?

[Backglass]

I use Firefox, but not the spellchecker. I have sufficient faith in my own skills.

To jay that's a religion ya know. Oh...and it's SPELL CHECKER. Two words.

[MeDeFe]

But it's only one entity, so logic dictates it should be one word. Besides, my trusty dictionary lists 3 versions, "spellchecker", "spell-checker" and, finally "spell checker"

[Backglass]

But it's only one entity, so logic dictates it should be one word. Besides, my trusty dictionary lists 3 versions, "spellchecker", "spell-checker" and, finally "spell checker"

Well, you are wrong. My spelling bible says so and it is the way! It was written many years ago by sage spelling experts who must never be questioned. They foresaw your multiple spellings and proclaimed that mine is the ONE, TRUE spelling. Any other spelling will cause you to burn for all eternity in the great afterlife spelling bee.

[muy_thaiguy]

Backglass, Me De Fe, please move it to another thread.

[MeDeFe]

All because of a small pun and an obscure reference to one of the earliest debate threads. *sigh*

[Backglass]

Your insistence on interrupting others is juvenile.

Disruption? Juvenile behavior? On a CC FORUM THREAD?

What you say!

We must put an end to this immediately because as we know, there is NO other way for users to message each other privately! There are NO christian web forums where these discussions take place! Instead they must be HERE....on a RISK based GAME sight!

For great justice!

[The1exile]

a RISK based GAME sight!

Bad spelers of the world... untie!

Or iTune!

Or something.

[Backglass]

a RISK based GAME sight!

Bad spelers of the world... untie!

Or iTune!

Or something.

So much for my SMITING! (smoting?)

[MR. Nate]

It would seem to me that any ignorance lies in believing all of the above is 100% accurate and without question.

Believing anything with question is certainly laying the grounds for ignorance. Which is why we are all supposed to constantly examine our beliefs. You know, "The unexamined life is not worth living."

I was just wondering if anyone on CC is involved with or gets information from different conservative value groups and if so, what groups are they, what do they specialize in?

I get political information from a few different ones, but for the most part, they are too focused on one or two issues, and are sort of the lukewarm culture of Christianity. They generally pour a ton of resources into political change, which seems like a less than Christlike response. Instead of freaking out over every issue, I'd prefer to see them invest in demonstrating the love of Christ.

I'm not one of the CC Jesus Freaks, but i peruse these discussions from time to time when Flame Wars gets boring. Some arguements here are interesting and well thought out, but most seem to be quasi religious tripe, and people simply following what they were taught to believe by their parents.

QFT

So much for my SMITING! (smoting?)

Backglass, you of all people should know that atheists aren't supposed to smite. It's a religious thing

[Backglass]

people simply following what they were taught to believe by their parents.[/b]

QFT

I believe this is the vast majority of religious people. They get you when you're young and impressionable.

So much for my SMITING! (smoting?)

Backglass, you of all people should know that atheists aren't supposed to smite. It's a religious thing

True. I shall never smite again.

[suggs]

I think it’s been proven pretty effectively, both in this thread and others, that while science, facts, and logic cannot prove that God exists, neither can they prove that he does not. Nevertheless, somehow an impression has been created that asserting that God exists is blind faith, and asserting that he does not is reason. NO THERE IS SIMPLY NO EVIDENCE TO BELIEVE THAT GOD EXISTS. THE BURDEN OF PROOF IS ON THE BELIEVER. I DONT BELIEVE BECAUSE THERE SEEMS NO VALID REASON TO-GOD HAS NOT "REVEALED" HIMSELF IN THE WORLD That is simply not true. Believing that God does not exist is no more rational than believing that he does. HENCE, IT IS IRRATIONAL TO BELIEVE IN A GOD. AS HUME PUT IT, WHY POSTULATE AN EXTRA CAUSE-THE WORLD SIMPLY IS.

The answer always comes, “Oh yeah, hide behind ‘it’s a mystery, we can’t understand it,’ that’s an intellectual cop out!” But the intellectual cop out is not facing that your supposed “proof” doesn’t prove anything. It is absolutely logical, given the premise, to realize that we are not going to understand all of the things he does, and absolutely illogical to expect that we would. ITS NOT A MYSTERY-THE WORLD JUST EXISTS. ALTHOUGH I GRANT YOU AUSCHWITZ IS TRICKY TOO UNDERSTAND...

[unriggable]

Suggs, I assume your response is in the quote?

[suggs]

Yes the stuff in capitals doesnt look great i'll grant you!
My point really though is that a belief in God seems irrational, and unnecessary.
If i said to you, i think a unicorn created the world, it would be very difficult, prob impossible to prove.
But it seems a an unnecessary assertion for me to make in the frst place.
I think William of Ockam put it better lol

[CrazyAnglican]

I think William of Ockam put it better lol

Seems a strange statement when William of Ockam was a theolgian whose ideas were so conservative that he was actually acquitted by an inquisition.

[suggs]

I think William of Ockam put it better lol

Seems a strange statement when William of Ockam was a theolgian whose ideas were so conservative that he was actually acquitted by an inquisition.

Are you being deliberately obtuse? Of course Ockham was a theologian-virtually any scholar in the 14/15 th century was.
But hes principle of the Razor has been a cornerstone of Anglo-American philosophy for centuries-simply put, dont postualte unnecessary causes (or postulates!) where one will do.
Thus, the world exists because...it is.

[beezer]

We must put an end to this immediately because as we know, there is NO other way for users to message each other privately! There are NO christian web forums where these discussions take place! Instead they must be HERE....on a RISK based GAME sight!

For great justice!

So I guess if you overheard two people talking about God across the street you would immediately run over and interrupt their conversation and tell them to take it inside to a private residence just because it bothered you.

[unriggable]

Question. What story is it where the sun stops in the sky?

[MR. Nate]

Joshua chapter 10

[unriggable]

Joshua chapter 10

Thanks a bunch...longest day of the year for a good revenge...sweet.

[CrazyAnglican]

I think William of Ockam put it better lol

Seems a strange statement when William of Ockam was a theolgian whose ideas were so conservative that he was actually acquitted by an inquisition.

Are you being deliberately obtuse? Of course Ockham was a theologian-virtually any scholar in the 14/15 th century was.
But hes principle of the Razor has been a cornerstone of Anglo-American philosophy for centuries-simply put, dont postualte unnecessary causes (or postulates!) where one will do.
Thus, the world exists because...it is.

Deliberately obtuse? Not at all, I just find it amusing that Ockham (as far as I've seen) did not intend for his razor to be used in a religious or even philosophical manner. As I understand it, its a way to save time when looking at material, mathematical, and measureable things. It's valuable in hard science and mathematics as it was intended to be because it allows the researcher to focus only on the most likely outcomes, period.

ie. If you have two points, assume a line until you have more points
to revise your assumption. Because sometimes two points are
part of a squiggling unpredictable line that one would never have
guessed.

Which is Hyperbole, of course, but it goes to the point
that Ockham's Razor is a way to make a "safe" assumption when
the evidence doesn't completely add up. It is certainly useful in
making small leaps, but becomes less reliable in larger ones. That is the farther you get from the evidence used to make your assumption the less likely your assumption is regardless of your method.

[Bavarian Raven]

what really gets me is how some people can believe despite the lack of evidence or how some of the stuff is physically impossible...

...take Noah's flood for instance....to cover all the earth's mountains in water would take a volume of water larger then the present volume of the earth! Just one of many examples...

[Neutrino]

This thread is an inquiry as to why certain members of Conquer Club believe in Jesus Christ. Don't believe me? Go back and read the title of this thread.

Intents and results are often quite different things...

This thread isn't about your opinion as it wasn't addressed to one single atheist here.

Actually, as a public forum post, it was, by definition, addressed to everyone's opinion.

If the OP actually wanted an inquiry, it wouldn't have taken much effort, after aquiring a couple of willing Christians, to transfer the conversation to IM or Email. Since they didn't do this, I can assume a debate was their objective, since this is what anything of a religious nature posted on this forum invariably turns into.

Also, don't you think it a little hypocritical for you to post a complaint about someone disrupting the thread, in the thread, thus creating more disruption when others respond to your off-topic post?

[CrazyAnglican]

what really gets me is how some people can believe despite the lack of evidence or how some of the stuff is physically impossible...

...take Noah's flood for instance....to cover all the earth's mountains in water would take a volume of water larger then the present volume of the earth! Just one of many examples...

To an extent you're right. Why would anyone believe such a thing? In the face of Ockham's razor, empiricism, and the like shouldn't everyone be beyond this? Are we all deliberately obtuse or just downright stupid?

The answer to the first question is of course different for different believers, but the answer to the second is of course not. In general, rational people do not presume that others are stupid merely for disagreeing with them. In Christianity, I find a way of looking at and living life that adds volumes to its quality. All miracles aside, It is just a very good way, at the heart of Christ's message, to live life.

Whether or not, some Christians have been bad people. The ones who read the scriptures, and try to follow them are not. At least the ones I've met are not and from what I've read of the New Testament they are not likely to be. With all of the possible objections to organized religion there are many factors in its favor as well.

My point, I guess, is that I see some of the same people that would applaud or respect someone who lives their life by a strong (non-religious) moral code (martial arts, philosophical societies, or military code, etc.) who object to religious living for no apparent better reason than that is what they have chosen to reject.

[DangerBoy]

This thread is an inquiry as to why certain members of Conquer Club believe in Jesus Christ. Don't believe me? Go back and read the title of this thread.

Intents and results are often quite different things...

This thread isn't about your opinion as it wasn't addressed to one single atheist here.

Actually, as a public forum post, it was, by definition, addressed to everyone's opinion.

If the OP actually wanted an inquiry, it wouldn't have taken much effort, after aquiring a couple of willing Christians, to transfer the conversation to IM or Email. Since they didn't do this, I can assume a debate was their objective, since this is what anything of a religious nature posted on this forum invariably turns into.

Also, don't you think it a little hypocritical for you to post a complaint about someone disrupting the thread, in the thread, thus creating more disruption when others respond to your off-topic post?

Here come the justifications.

[muy_thaiguy]

what really gets me is how some people can believe despite the lack of evidence or how some of the stuff is physically impossible...

...take Noah's flood for instance....to cover all the earth's mountains in water would take a volume of water larger then the present volume of the earth! Just one of many examples...

To an extent you're right. Why would anyone believe such a thing? In the face of Ockham's razor, empiricism, and the like shouldn't everyone be beyond this? Are we all deliberately obtuse or just downright stupid?

The answer to the first question is of course different for different believers, but the answer to the second is of course not. In general, rational people do not presume that others are stupid merely for disagreeing with them. In Christianity, I find a way of looking at and living life that adds volumes to its quality. All miracles aside, It is just a very good way, at the heart of Christ's message, to live life.

Whether or not, some Christians have been bad people. The ones who read the scriptures, and try to follow them are not. At least the ones I've met are not and from what I've read of the New Testament they are not likely to be. With all of the possible objections to organized religion there are many factors in its favor as well.

My point, I guess, is that I see some of the same people that would applaud or respect someone who lives their life by a strong (non-religious) moral code (martial arts, philosophical societies, or military code, etc.) who object to religious living for no apparent better reason than that is what they have chosen to reject.

Hey CA, I do Martial Arts, and it only has helped me with my faith.