KEYOGI wrote:Thanks for those comments DiM.
KEYOGI wrote:Marking out continents has been one of the biggest challenges of this map. We've had coloured rings around army cirlces, coloured borders, a colour over the continents, various fades, gradients, etc, etc. These sort of issues have taken up a great deal more time than creating the actual landscape.
yes i understand but as i said i find it really hard to spot what country belongs to what continent. i like to have a clear perspective at a glance. and frankly i can't here. while i really appreciate your efforts i still feel something other than just colored terit names needs to be done. perhaps try and offer a few alternatives with fades gradients, etc and let people choose the less intrusive one.
KEYOGI wrote:I understand your concerns about the house of Stark. All the territories and continents are taken directly from the first book, so we were left with little to do but try and fit gameplay as best we could around our limitations. The Stark's have four defensive territories and border four out of six of the other houses. To me at least, this is as close as we could arrange it to act like it is in the middle of the map. There's 13 territories in total for the Starks and a bonus of 7 which seems justified. I'm not against reducing the bonus to 6 if people are really worried they will be too strong.
i'm not debating the bonus of stark. 7 is good. i'm just debating it's position. stark is like asia big continent big bonus. but unlike asia it is very isolated. it's not a passing continent. it's crammed into a corner. and as i said if somebody is unlucky enough to start there he has no chance of winning. in a 6 player game he could easily end up there with 5-6 terits. he can't expand quick enough to get the whole continent and he has no other option to run to. for example on classic if you have 5-6 terits in asia you can easily go to australia and get a bonus. but 5-6 terits in stark are a crappy start. and by the time you manage to get the whole continent probably the others already have more troops than you and won't let you keep it.
KEYOGI wrote:The Baratheon's is another large continent with 8 territories, so I think most of the action at the start would be in the other five houses. I agree the Tully's are overpowered with a bonus of 3, I think 2 would be more fitting. The same for the Arryns.
if you put 2 for tully you can't put 2 for arryn. tully is like belgish in benelux map. so just +1. 2 for arryn is good.
KEYOGI wrote:Remember, these bonus numbers came straight from the Excel file. We wanted to get opinions on the bonuses, thus why we didn't change them ourselves. I think a bonus of 4 would be most suited for the Lannister's and probably 5 for the Tyrell's. I really would have liked to reduce the borders for the Tyrell's, but there's not really any way to do this without using impassables.
the excell file is not that great. yes it offers you a basic idea but i've stated this many times. the excell file treats each continent as a single entity. it can't see the map as a whole. for example 2 continents may be worth +3 each in the excell file but when you look at the map you see you can hold both of them with just one border due to the overall layout. would it be right to get a +6 with just 1 border? obviously not so the solution is to reduce their bonus to +2 each.
what i do (don't know if i said this before) when i analyze a map is this.
enter all the continents in excell and get some values. then figure different expansion processes on the map and see groups of continents that can be formed. for example let's take the australia map. i calculate the bonus for all the continents and then i figure the expansions. someone starting in victoria will naturally go for new south wales. i consider the new formed continent which actually consists of the 2 continents. enter the new data in the excell and get a new bonus. now i tweak the previous bonuses to correspond to the new one. i hope that is clear.
KEYOGI wrote:The map is based on the series of books A Song of Ice and Fire. The map as represented in the books is split in two because it's so tall. If the map was to be done properly, it would be at least as big as mibi's Trojan War map, which is so far beyond the size limitations it's not funny.
i like big maps. i don't see a problem with that. to be frank i consider size limitations to be wrong. if i have a small monitor and the map is too big i'll stick to the small maps and play just those. if the size restrictions would be taken out there would be a natural selection. people won't do 4000*4000px maps because nobody would play them and so they would go as far as the foundry let's them. people complained about the AoM size a lot. i could not make it any smaller so i kept it at 800*800 and people still play it. i agree perhaps i lost some potential players along the way due to size but the fact that people still play it proves i did not exaggerate. if mibi gets trojan quenched perhaps nobody will play it due to size (though i doubt it) and so we'll have a clear statement of what is too much.
KEYOGI wrote:Could you mention specifically which overlapping names are bothering you? The only one I can identify with enough room to move is Silverhill.
silverhill. move right
crakehall. move right
riverrun. move left
ashford. move right and a bit down
the tor. move right
salt shore. move left
storm's end. move right and a bit up
the dreadfort. this is problematic because you can move the text but not the army circle. but the ones above can be solved with moving both.
“In the beginning God said, the four-dimensional divergence of an antisymmetric, second rank tensor equals zero, and there was light, and it was good. And on the seventh day he rested.”- Michio Kaku