Poll on Marriage (Fed vs State vs. Church)

[PLAYER57832]

You have no authority to claim that your morals are better than any other person's morals.

Bravo! Ten points to Night Strike! You're finally grasping some basic concepts of reality.

I don't have any authority to claim that my morals are objective. And neither have you, or anyone else. Not even if you claim your morals are given to you by some bronze-age invention known as "GOD".

Therefore, what is considered moral is defined by consensus, in such a way that is beneficial to the collective. Everyone has the freedom to do whatever they want as long as their actions cause no harm to others, nor deprive others of their freedom to do what they want as long as their actions cause no harm to others... and so on and so on. Hey, it's recursive morality! Everyone wins!

But if we allow gay marriage god will kill a couple more hundred k people with hurricanes and tsunamis, therefore gay marriage is immoral.

CHECKMATE.

show the religion that says that... hint, it isn't Christianity...

[PLAYER57832]

Of course humans aren't capable of 100% objectivity, which is why we have a Creator who set down the objective morals and immutable truths that are in existence.

Except, your argumens with me show the falsity of that idea. I read the Bible, you read the Bible, and each of us feels it says very different things. It is not God, therefore, it is how humans percieve God. And, because none of us IS Christ, none of us has his power to dictate. In fact, if you read the New Testament, it is quite clear that he gave little direction on many of this isses. Perhaps the greatest danger is not in ignoring, but in attempting to claim the Bible says things it does not say, claiming Christ put down laws that are actually things individual humans have adopted.

Roman Catholics like to claim, of course, that the Pope is the best and greatest interpreter, but the rest of us Protestants rather disagree... and hold his holiness in no more higher elevation or esteem than any other worldly, educated leader.

The problem of morality is the largest problem inherent in evolution and atheism.

Evolution is science, fact. Atheism is an idea. How is morality a problem in either? If you see God as giving rise to morality, then you might envision atheists to have none. That is incorrect. They do have morals, even if they come from a different base.

Evolution, though.. how on Earth can you possibly tie that to morality in honesty and truth?

[BigBallinStalin]

'Is it right because the gods command it, or do they command it because it is right?'

Ancient question... I'm surprised no one mentioned this when nS went off about religion and morality. Either morality is arbitrarily determined by the god(s), or morality exists independently from the god(s).

[PLAYER57832]

'Is it right because the gods command it, or do they command it because it is right?'

Ancient question... I'm surprised no one mentioned this when nS went off about religion and morality. Either morality is arbitrarily determined by the god(s), or morality exists independently from the god(s).

It can be even more basic than that, because any way of being/thinking is "morality".

However, if you refer to what we commonly consider "good" behavior and therefore "moral" behavior and choices, it is the basic question.

Those 2 things have been blurred above.

[vodean]

'Is it right because the gods command it, or do they command it because it is right?'

Ancient question... I'm surprised no one mentioned this when nS went off about religion and morality. Either morality is arbitrarily determined by the god(s), or morality exists independently from the god(s).

if you believe in gods, then they make right and wrong

[rdsrds2120]

'Is it right because the gods command it, or do they command it because it is right?'

Ancient question... I'm surprised no one mentioned this when nS went off about religion and morality. Either morality is arbitrarily determined by the god(s), or morality exists independently from the god(s).

Have you been reading Plato lately?

-rd

[AAFitz]

'Is it right because the gods command it, or do they command it because it is right?'

Ancient question... I'm surprised no one mentioned this when nS went off about religion and morality. Either morality is arbitrarily determined by the god(s), or morality exists independently from the god(s).

It can be even more basic than that, because any way of being/thinking is "morality".

However, if you refer to what we commonly consider "good" behavior and therefore "moral" behavior and choices, it is the basic question.

Those 2 things have been blurred above.

Exactly.

Slavery was once considered moral by the same people who would have considered gay marriage immoral. And probably, still is by some.

[natty dread]

'Is it right because the gods command it, or do they command it because it is right?'

Ancient question... I'm surprised no one mentioned this when nS went off about religion and morality. Either morality is arbitrarily determined by the god(s), or morality exists independently from the god(s).

Have you been reading Plato lately?

-rd

Mickey's dog can write?

[Nola_Lifer]

So if I wanna marry 5 dudes is that gay marriage or polygamy?

homosexual polyamory

Sounds kind of sexy...

[Phatscotty]

'Is it right because the gods command it, or do they command it because it is right?'

Ancient question... I'm surprised no one mentioned this when nS went off about religion and morality. Either morality is arbitrarily determined by the god(s), or morality exists independently from the god(s).

It can be even more basic than that, because any way of being/thinking is "morality".

However, if you refer to what we commonly consider "good" behavior and therefore "moral" behavior and choices, it is the basic question.

Those 2 things have been blurred above.

Exactly.

Slavery was once considered moral by the same people who would have considered gay marriage immoral. And probably, still is by some.

17th century slave-owners are the same thing as people today who are for one man/one woman?

These kind of completely insane fascist bully tactics are exactly why you guys are losing.

[natty dread]

17th century slave-owners are the same thing as people today who are for one man/one woman?

Yes

These kind of completely insane fascist bully tactics are exactly why you guys are losing.

Losing... what? Is this another us vs. them thing, Phatscotty? Is everything in the world divided into conservatives and libhruls?

Also, I know you like to pretend like you're this downtrodden, persecuted Hero of the People, but you're not. You're just a plain old bigot who's pissed to see the world changing.

[Phatscotty]

17th century slave-owners are the same thing as people today who are for one man/one woman?

Yes

These kind of completely insane fascist bully tactics are exactly why you guys are losing.

Losing... what? Is this another us vs. them thing, Phatscotty? Is everything in the world divided into conservatives and libhruls?

Also, I know you like to pretend like you're this downtrodden, persecuted Hero of the People, but you're not. You're just a plain old bigot who's pissed to see the world changing.

Of course it is. There are 2 positions. The position that same-sex marriage should be recognized by society has lost every time the people have had a democratic vote on the matter. The position that marriage is between one man and one woman has won, every single time.

Everything on the issue of same-sex marriage is one position against the other. I am not talking about everything in the world

The world isn't changing. We have decided to keep it the same, concerning marriage anyways. A reality you can't ignore.

This is what Democracy looks like!

[Haggis_McMutton]

US vs. THEM. US vs. THEM. US vs. THEM. HURRRAAAAH

God, I really do hope you're a troll scotty.

[AAFitz]

17th century slave-owners are the same thing as people today who are for one man/one woman?

Yes

These kind of completely insane fascist bully tactics are exactly why you guys are losing.

Losing... what? Is this another us vs. them thing, Phatscotty? Is everything in the world divided into conservatives and libhruls?

Also, I know you like to pretend like you're this downtrodden, persecuted Hero of the People, but you're not. You're just a plain old bigot who's pissed to see the world changing.

Of course it is. There are 2 positions. The position that same-sex marriage should be recognized by society has lost every time the people have had a democratic vote on the matter. The position that marriage is between one man and one woman has won, every single time.

Everything on the issue of same-sex marriage is one position against the other. I am not talking about everything in the world

The world isn't changing. We have decided to keep it the same, concerning marriage anyways. A reality you can't ignore.

This is what Democracy looks like!

So, if democracy allowed human slavery, would you agree with it?

The question is rhetorical of course, we all know you would, but the point is, Democracy, often, is not pretty, which is why we have laws, that are not fully democratic.

[AAFitz]

'Is it right because the gods command it, or do they command it because it is right?'

Ancient question... I'm surprised no one mentioned this when nS went off about religion and morality. Either morality is arbitrarily determined by the god(s), or morality exists independently from the god(s).

It can be even more basic than that, because any way of being/thinking is "morality".

However, if you refer to what we commonly consider "good" behavior and therefore "moral" behavior and choices, it is the basic question.

Those 2 things have been blurred above.

Exactly.

Slavery was once considered moral by the same people who would have considered gay marriage immoral. And probably, still is by some.

17th century slave-owners are the same thing as people today who are for one man/one woman?

These kind of completely insane fascist bully tactics are exactly why you guys are losing.

Its not an insane bully tactic. And Im not losing anything. Im simply standing up against oppressors who are Un-american to the core like yourself. The conservatives who fight change are the ones who lose, and always lose. It just takes time.

There were plenty that fought to keep slavery like yourself.

Plenty that fought to restrict inter-racial marriage like yourself.

Plenty that fought to restrict womens voting rights.

They all lost, and so will you. Its only ever a matter of time.

Not only will I win, but I will have been winning the entire time.

[Phatscotty]

'Is it right because the gods command it, or do they command it because it is right?'

Ancient question... I'm surprised no one mentioned this when nS went off about religion and morality. Either morality is arbitrarily determined by the god(s), or morality exists independently from the god(s).

It can be even more basic than that, because any way of being/thinking is "morality".

However, if you refer to what we commonly consider "good" behavior and therefore "moral" behavior and choices, it is the basic question.

Those 2 things have been blurred above.

Exactly.

Slavery was once considered moral by the same people who would have considered gay marriage immoral. And probably, still is by some.

That is the most absurd thing I have ever heard. However, that's all I really expected anyways

[AAFitz]

'Is it right because the gods command it, or do they command it because it is right?'

Ancient question... I'm surprised no one mentioned this when nS went off about religion and morality. Either morality is arbitrarily determined by the god(s), or morality exists independently from the god(s).

It can be even more basic than that, because any way of being/thinking is "morality".

However, if you refer to what we commonly consider "good" behavior and therefore "moral" behavior and choices, it is the basic question.

Those 2 things have been blurred above.

Exactly.

Slavery was once considered moral by the same people who would have considered gay marriage immoral. And probably, still is by some.

That is the most absurd thing I have ever heard. However, that's all I really expected anyways

Its absurd, because you simply are too blind to understand it. And, trust me, we all expect that from you.

But that doesn't take away from the fun of pointing it out.

[Phatscotty]

'Is it right because the gods command it, or do they command it because it is right?'

Ancient question... I'm surprised no one mentioned this when nS went off about religion and morality. Either morality is arbitrarily determined by the god(s), or morality exists independently from the god(s).

It can be even more basic than that, because any way of being/thinking is "morality".

However, if you refer to what we commonly consider "good" behavior and therefore "moral" behavior and choices, it is the basic question.

Those 2 things have been blurred above.

Exactly.

Slavery was once considered moral by the same people who would have considered gay marriage immoral. And probably, still is by some.

17th century slave-owners are the same thing as people today who are for one man/one woman?

These kind of completely insane fascist bully tactics are exactly why you guys are losing.

Its not an insane bully tactic. And Im not losing anything. Im simply standing up against oppressors who are Un-american to the core like yourself. The conservatives who fight change are the ones who lose, and always lose. It just takes time.

Lie #1 There were plenty that fought to keep slavery like yourself.

Lie #2 Plenty that fought to restrict inter-racial marriage like yourself.

Lie #3 Plenty that fought to restrict womens voting rights.

Lie #4They all lost, and so will you. Its only ever a matter of time.

Lie #5Not only will I win, but I will have been winning the entire time.

Lie #1 How am I a Democrat?
Lie #2 Plenty of Republicans who fought....
Lie #3 See lie #2
Lie #4 You already lost. Every single state that has a say voted not to change the definition of marriage.
Lie #5 See lie #4

Congratulations. You have created a bubble for yourself that does not exist on planet earth.

[Phatscotty]

'Is it right because the gods command it, or do they command it because it is right?'

Ancient question... I'm surprised no one mentioned this when nS went off about religion and morality. Either morality is arbitrarily determined by the god(s), or morality exists independently from the god(s).

It can be even more basic than that, because any way of being/thinking is "morality".

However, if you refer to what we commonly consider "good" behavior and therefore "moral" behavior and choices, it is the basic question.

Those 2 things have been blurred above.

Exactly.

Slavery was once considered moral by the same people who would have considered gay marriage immoral. And probably, still is by some.

That is the most absurd thing I have ever heard. However, that's all I really expected anyways

Its absurd, because you simply are too blind to understand it. And, trust me, we all expect that from you.

But that doesn't take away from the fun of pointing it out.

Oh, which states have you won? Which states have I lost?

I only have one thing to say to you.... SCOREBOARD

[Phatscotty]

US vs. THEM. US vs. THEM. US vs. THEM. HURRRAAAAH

God, I really do hope you're a troll scotty.

You are trolling a troll. I didn't write that.

You can't seem to help sticking your foot in your mouth

[Phatscotty]

17th century slave-owners are the same thing as people today who are for one man/one woman?

Yes

These kind of completely insane fascist bully tactics are exactly why you guys are losing.

Losing... what? Is this another us vs. them thing, Phatscotty? Is everything in the world divided into conservatives and libhruls?

Also, I know you like to pretend like you're this downtrodden, persecuted Hero of the People, but you're not. You're just a plain old bigot who's pissed to see the world changing.

Of course it is. There are 2 positions. The position that same-sex marriage should be recognized by society has lost every time the people have had a democratic vote on the matter. The position that marriage is between one man and one woman has won, every single time.

Everything on the issue of same-sex marriage is one position against the other. I am not talking about everything in the world

The world isn't changing. We have decided to keep it the same, concerning marriage anyways. A reality you can't ignore.

This is what Democracy looks like!

So, if democracy allowed human slavery, would you agree with it?

The question is rhetorical of course, we all know you would, but the point is, Democracy, often, is not pretty, which is why we have laws, that are not fully democratic.

Exactly. And we are democratically re-affirming one of them

[Haggis_McMutton]

US vs. THEM. US vs. THEM. US vs. THEM. HURRRAAAAH

God, I really do hope you're a troll scotty.

You are trolling a troll. I didn't write that.

You can't seem to help sticking your foot in your mouth

Huh? Count to 10 before posting scotty, count to 10.

Also, investigate the mysterious edit button.

[GreecePwns]

So again, why at the state level, Scotty? Why not at the town level?

[Phatscotty]

So again, why at the state level, Scotty? Why not at the town level?

Aren't you also asking "why not ignore the constitution"?

[Phatscotty]

US vs. THEM. US vs. THEM. US vs. THEM. HURRRAAAAH

God, I really do hope you're a troll scotty.

You are trolling a troll. I didn't write that.

You can't seem to help sticking your foot in your mouth

Huh? Count to 10 before posting scotty, count to 10.

Also, investigate the mysterious edit button.

the only one trolling is you pal