Post Any Evidence For God Here

[HitRed]

Why would humanity need a God?

Because humans die.

Spoiler

I tell you truly, if you wish eternal life, you must come to me while there is still time. - God

[mookiemcgee]

Why would humanity need a God?

Because humans die.

Oh man, he's so close.

[Apatheist]

TRY IT; Learn from Reading, Apatheist.

I read Ezekiel. Try reading it without blinkers (or did you mean the town in Berkshire, England? )
I'll give you some hints:

• The Descending Craft: The "windstorm coming out of the north," the "immense cloud with flashing lightning," and a glowing core like "gleaming bronze" (Ezekiel 1:4) are interpreted as the smoke, fire, and heat generated by a spacecraft descending through the atmosphere. [As Captain Kirk says, why would god need a spaceship?]
• The Living Creatures: Ezekiel describes four living creatures with human forms, four wings, and straight legs with sparkled bronze feet (Ezekiel 1:5-7). Space theorists argue these were actually structural supports, landing gear, or mechanical helicopter-like rotor blades.
• The "Wheel Within a Wheel": Ezekiel describes wheels that could move in any direction without turning, rims "full of eyes," and the ability to lift off the ground (Ezekiel 1:15-19). In engineering terms, theorists view this as a multi-directional propulsion system or landing gear wheels.
• The Expanse and the Throne: The "expanse, sparkling like ice" above the creatures' heads (Ezekiel 1:22) is re-imagined as a glass cockpit or capsule ceiling, while the "likeness of a throne" (Ezekiel 1:26) is viewed as the pilot's command module.

Try reading this, you may find it amusing:
https://www.cantab.net/users/michael.be ... er_05.html

open to many interpretations; NO one can claim certainty.

Put it in CONTEXT: Aliens, not likely. Encounter with God or Messenger or Angel? maybe

read Crash go the Chariots, book.

Put yourself in the position of a shepherd thousands of years before anyone understood science, trying to describe phenomena that seemed otherworldly. How would they describe space craft, helicopters, air craft, jet packs, space suits, tractor beams and all the stuff we know about now?
They didn't know about other planets, so the only thing they could think of was some sort of heaven.
I think Aliens is at least as likely as angels. We know life exists on at least one planet and interplanetary travel is possible. We don't know that angels exist at all.

The other explanation, which is also at least as likely, is the plant-induced hallucinations that have been mentioned before.
There's no hard evidence, but this is some of the speculation:

• The "Burning Bush" and Acacia Theory:
Some researchers, such as cognitive psychologist Benny Shanon, have proposed speculative hypotheses suggesting that events like Moses and the burning bush or the revelations at Mount Sinai could have involved natural psychoactive substances. For instance, acacia trees (common in the Sinai and Middle Eastern deserts) contain DMT (a potent psychedelic compound), leading some to hypothesize-without hard proof—that natural fumes or plant brews played a role.
• Anointing Oils and Incense:
Other writers have suggested that ancient temple ingredients—such as kaneh-bosem (disputed by botanists as either cannabis or sweet cane/lemongrass) or the holy anointing oils and tabernacle incense described in Exodus—might have had mind-altering or sensory-enhancing properties for the priesthood, though these claims remain heavily contested.
• Wider Ancient Context:
Archaeologists have found evidence that surrounding ancient cultures (such as the Philistines, ancient Egyptians, or participants in the Greek Eleusinian Mysteries) used plant-based intoxicants, henbane, or psychoactive brews in rituals. However, mainstream historians emphasize a large gap between general ancient near-eastern folk/pagan practices and the specific accounts of biblical or monotheistic prophets.

I agree that we'll never know; but, based on the evidence and how it fits the text, I think angels is actually the lease likely explanation.

[jusplay4fun]

Key phrase:

There's no hard evidence, but this is some of the speculation

[Apatheist]

Key phrase:

There's no hard evidence, but this is some of the speculation

This is the way which anything that comes to us via oral tradition. Somewhere along the line though, someone may speculate accurately. It's just another possibility.
The logic I follow is this:
Either the author made up the entire thing; or they reported something that someone else told them.
That person could have made up the whole thing, or reported what someone else told them, all the way to the beginning.
In the first instance: either it was completely made up, or they believed they saw something.
They may have seen it through hallucination, or it was actually there.
If it were actually there, and anything like what was reported (ie flying beings), then it was almost certainly extra-terrestrial since we have no evidence that the technology existed in that time and place.
It's then just a matter of whether the origin was heaven, another planet, another dimension or - as I speculated in the book I started on the subject, but never finished, which I why I read up on it - another time in this planet's history.
Of those, the only one we know to exist is interplanetary travel.

[jusplay4fun]

Regarding the book Crash Go the Chariots:

He notes, “The hypothesis is put forward by [von Daniken] that [the Piri Re’is maps] must have been taken from a high-flying aircraft or from a spaceship. Piri Re’is himself stated on the map in question that he had consulted over 20 different earlier charts in the preparation of his own work… One interesting sidelight is that the River Amazon is shown twice… which can probably be explained by the fact that it WAS a piecing together of a number of charts.” (Pg. 78) (...)

For the idea that Ezekiel 1 describes spaceships, he suggests, “Ezekiel says that he saw ‘visions from God.’ ‘Visions’ are not necessarily literal phenomena… Ezekiel’s prophecy includes much symbolic teaching… In view of the clear statements as to the symbolic elements and the visionary presentation of this prophecy, there is little point in further following the outlandish interpretations … as to the experiences of Ezekiel.” (Pg. 94) (...)

He states, “Would con Daniken accept the Mayan belief that the earth rested on the back of a crocodile?... Von Daniken insists… that these people knew the earth was round. But how did the crocodile fit in? As a matter of fact, knowledge of a round earth was not restricted to the Mayas.” (Pg. 98) Later, he adds, I find it hard to believe that von Daniken takes these legends and folklore so seriously. It seems clear that a great many such statements cannot possibly be taken as expressions of literal fact in the sense that von Daniken accepts them…” (Pg. 110)

He concludes, “We do not discount the mysterious, and we readily acknowledge that startling knowledge was demonstrated in the construction of the pyramids and many other ancient buildings. However… that certainly does not mean we must look for the explanations by calling up visitors from outer space…. If early men did live for great periods of time, even apart from the Bible there is good reason to believe this, then in some areas their knowledge is likely to be significantly greater than that of twentieth century man… It is not really surprising that sometimes our ancestors had a knowledge beyond our own. That knowledge had its origin in God Himself.” (Pg. 160-161)

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/687 ... e_Chariots

More Reviews, on Amazon

Review of Crash Go The Chariots
Reviewed in the United States on February 9, 2016
Format: Mass Market Paperback
Verified Purchase
The theory of extraterrestrial life coming to earth is put down by this scholarly work.

An awakening
Reviewed in the United States on April 23, 2017
I read this book in the late 70s after spending most of that decade as a 'True Believer'. It woke me up to how easy it is to confuse and bamboozle people into believing unsubstantiated nonsense. It was an awakening to skepticism, and I haven't looked back since. I'm grateful to this books for opening my eyes to the charms of the con artists out there who only want my money and who have very little regard for the truth.

[Apatheist]

Just other people's opinions. I didn't mention von Däniken at all; I don't find his explanation entirely credible or appropriate.
As I said, I read Ezekiel myself; you can find a version of the text here: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?s ... sion=NABRE

1:4 As I watched, a great stormwind came from the North, a large cloud with flashing fire, a bright glow all around it, and something like polished metal gleamed at the center of the fire.

It is that hard to picture a craft with smoke coming from some sort of noisy engine?

1:22 Above the heads of the living creatures was a likeness of the firmament; it was awesome, stretching upwards like shining crystal over their heads.
1:24 Then I heard the sound of their wings, like the roaring of mighty waters, like the voice of the Almighty. When they moved, the sound of the tumult was like the din of an army. And when they stood still, they lowered their wings.
3:12 Then the spirit lifted me up, and I heard behind me a loud rumbling noise as the glory of the Lord rose from its place: the noise of the wings of the living creatures beating against one another, and the noise of the wheels alongside them, a loud rumbling.

Can you really say that's not a craft flying, landing and taking off?
How else would a priest from 600BC describe things?

[jusplay4fun]

As I said, there are different interpretations. We will not know for sure what is the TRUTH, not in this World.

Your interpretation, Apatheist, is no more valid than mine. I did offer other perspectives that support my OPINION.

The arguments made in Crash Go the Chariots are valid and relevant to what you present.

And YES, what you quoted CAN be interpreted as a spaceship; I agree. BUT that does not make that INTERPRETATION valid.